Author Topic: Why CB over V2005express, etc.  (Read 9895 times)

Offline Phantoms

  • Single posting newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« on: October 17, 2007, 03:15:57 am »
On another forums, I was recommended by several users to use MS VisualC++ 2005 express and I asked the question there, Why VC instead of CB. 

So now I'm asking here, why CB over VC?

I will give away my decision before anyone answers (please don't let this taint your answers).

I used VC++ 2005 express for a week after many suggestions and decided to stick with CodeBlocks. Let me say I'm a beginner and learning C++ (a hard language to learn).

Later on, VC++ may be a better choice, but for someone learning C++, CodeBlocks is much better suited. Start a new project, select console and a file name and you're all set. VC++ produces several support files, etc. for the same simple project you're working on in CB that only includes what you ask it too.

Offline stahta01

  • Lives here!
  • ****
  • Posts: 6613
    • My Best Post
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2007, 03:41:53 am »
I myself do not use debugger very often, so the more, reported as, integrated GUI debugger is one reason to use the IDE & Compiler MSVC++ instead of the IDE Code::Blocks and Compiler MSVC++. Which compiler to use with Code::Blocks depends on many things, the platforms and libraries you are planning to use and support. I normally use C::B to compile open source projects; so, I use MinGW GCC as my compiler. I hope to switch to Linux in the near future and that is the main reason I am using Code::Blocks as my IDE.

FYI, I am doing the open source projects to improve my C++ programming skills.

Tim S
C Programmer working to learn more about C++ and Git.
On Windows 7 64 bit and Windows 10 32 bit.
On Debian Stretch, compiling CB Trunk against wxWidgets 3.0.
--
When in doubt, read the CB WiKi FAQ. http://wiki.codeblocks.org

Offline thomas

  • Administrator
  • Lives here!
  • *****
  • Posts: 3979
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2007, 11:15:09 am »
For me, the main reasons why I use Code::Blocks are
  • It's pretty cool being able to modify the IDE one is using.
  • GCC is a great compiler, and Code::Blocks is made for GCC.
  • It's cool that Code::Blocks runs on Linux, too. I'm not using that feature, but the point is, I could, if I wanted to.
  • Money. They charge me 799 dollars for a (more or less) usable version of Visual Studio, while giving it out for free in India. No thank you.
  • I would need a computer with more RAM and more CPU cores to run Visual Studio. While poverty is not really a problem as such, I simply don't see the need.
  • Refusal to support the monopolism of proprietary, undisclosed, undocumented, unsophisticated, unfree, un-anything standards. It's bad enough having to use Windows due to lack of alternatives.
"We should forget about small efficiencies, say about 97% of the time: Premature quotation is the root of public humiliation."

Offline Jan van den Borst

  • Multiple posting newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 99
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2007, 11:33:39 am »
I agree with Thomas.

I want to add that it is fairly simple to copy an existing compiler and make support for a new one (and use the outstanding CB build engine) That is what I did for an embedded project that uses ARM realview compiler.

Also the editor is great and I find myself switching from MSVC to codeblocks just for editing my files and beautify them with Astyle.

Jan

Offline Biplab

  • Developer
  • Lives here!
  • *****
  • Posts: 1874
    • Biplab's Blog
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2007, 12:34:38 pm »
  • Money. They charge me 799 dollars for a (more or less) usable version of Visual Studio, while giving it out for free in India. No thank you.

No they don't give MSVS for free in India. The worst thing is they charge nearly same amount in local currency. So if you are paying $799, an Indian buyer would pay around Rs.20,000 (approx) for a Standard Edition license. :)

Consider the fact that an average programmer in India gets about $500-700 per month as salary whereas any US/EU counterpart gets a lot more than that.

But I agree with your other points. :)
Be a part of the solution, not a part of the problem.

Offline JGM

  • Lives here!
  • ****
  • Posts: 518
  • Got to practice :)
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2007, 03:03:54 pm »
It's bad enough having to use Windows due to lack of alternatives.

ReactOS is an OS with great progress, I always monitor their status. If no body have heard of it here is the url http://www.reactos.org/. I would like to help them, but that people is on another level of programming  :P

Offline stahta01

  • Lives here!
  • ****
  • Posts: 6613
    • My Best Post
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2007, 03:52:52 pm »

ReactOS is an OS with great progress, I always monitor their status. If no body have heard of it here is the url http://www.reactos.org/. I would like to help them, but that people is on another level of programming  :P

I have been watching ReactOS and I can most of the time I can compile SVN, so I might start looking at the code and see if I can help with very minor things. Still have not gotten a good VM of ReactOS going.

Tim S
C Programmer working to learn more about C++ and Git.
On Windows 7 64 bit and Windows 10 32 bit.
On Debian Stretch, compiling CB Trunk against wxWidgets 3.0.
--
When in doubt, read the CB WiKi FAQ. http://wiki.codeblocks.org

Offline thomas

  • Administrator
  • Lives here!
  • *****
  • Posts: 3979
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2007, 05:11:06 pm »
Well, ReactOS has the same problem as Linux (MacOS, BeOS, ...). They're all well-meant and great, certainly much better than Windows, and such... but they have one problem, they just don't work as desktop systems. Mostly, that's because third parties don't properly support them (drivers), or because just the one program you want doesn't run (and then it does not matter if 213 other programs work fine).

I plug my standard nVidia graphics card into my standard Windows PC and it just works. I attach a second standard monitor and click on "expand desktop", and it just works. I want to play "Lord of the Rings Online", and it just works. I plug in my SpaceNavigator, it tells me "click OK to install driver", and it just works...

Under all those "better" operating systems, my experience is that things either don't work at all, or they take 4 hours to set up and then only work half way (like, software rendering with a Geforce 8600 plugged in).
This doesn't necessarily mean that those operating systems are bad, they aren't... but they just don't work as dektop systems if the most basic things are amiss.
"We should forget about small efficiencies, say about 97% of the time: Premature quotation is the root of public humiliation."

Offline cmb

  • Single posting newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2007, 06:27:27 pm »
Also the editor is great and I find myself switching from MSVC to codeblocks just for editing my files and beautify them with Astyle.

The AStyle equivalent in Microsoft Visual Studio is Control + K then Control + F.

Offline cmb

  • Single posting newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2007, 06:33:42 pm »
Money. They charge me 799 dollars for a (more or less) usable version of Visual Studio, while giving it out for free in India.

To clarify, the original poster mentioned the Express version of Visual Studio which I think is free to everybody.  Versions with more (and perhaps unneeded) features require the outlay of significant amounts of currency.

I like to switch between Visual Studio and Code::Blocks compiling with GCC especially when having a problem.  A cryptic error message in one may make more sense in the other.

Offline JGM

  • Lives here!
  • ****
  • Posts: 518
  • Got to practice :)
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2007, 07:07:48 pm »
Well, ReactOS has the same problem as Linux (MacOS, BeOS, ...).

But jey, ReactOS is still on alpha, there target is to become compatible with current implementations of windows, so all your windows software will ran on it, as drivers, games. Thats a big diffrence from linux and other operating systems. Maybe there will pass like 4 more years to see a windows xp 100% compatible OS, but if more developers join them, they will do it in less time!

Offline Phantoms

  • Single posting newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2007, 02:49:18 am »
Thanks for the replies. I'm sticking with CB with MinGW for the moment. I have not uninstalled VC2005 or the Platform SDK as I may have a need (or want) for it in the future. CB fits my needs currently, and that is to learn C++.

-James

Offline thomas

  • Administrator
  • Lives here!
  • *****
  • Posts: 3979
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2007, 09:03:52 am »
To clarify, the original poster mentioned the Express version of Visual Studio which I think is free to everybody.
That is why I said "a (more or less) usable version". The Express version is not usable (for anything serious). Obviously, this is not intended either, since nobody would buy the full version otherwise.
"We should forget about small efficiencies, say about 97% of the time: Premature quotation is the root of public humiliation."

Offline anarxia

  • Single posting newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 7
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #13 on: October 19, 2007, 10:47:57 am »
For me the main reason is multiple compiler support. I compile most of my projects with mingw, msvc7.1 and msvc8. I get better warnings and my code is more portable.

Offline L_O_J

  • Multiple posting newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 10
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2007, 06:09:59 pm »
To clarify, the original poster mentioned the Express version of Visual Studio which I think is free to everybody.
That is why I said "a (more or less) usable version". The Express version is not usable (for anything serious). Obviously, this is not intended either, since nobody would buy the full version otherwise.

Wow !, So I guest Burger Rush is not serious software. It depends on the person NOT the IDE, MSVC Express + PSDK is enough to make a win32 app, throw wxWidgets to that you got easier GUI programming, throw DirectX SDK (or SDL, or OpenGL, or Allegro), you can make a game. So please define what serious is ????
« Last Edit: October 19, 2007, 06:12:52 pm by L_O_J »

Offline Game_Ender

  • Lives here!
  • ****
  • Posts: 551
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #15 on: October 20, 2007, 05:39:37 am »
The lack of plugin support can cause problems.  Microsoft did explicitly to limit the usage of the express version, if they hadn't most likely the users would of created enough free plugins to make the express version so usable most people would not upgrade.

Offline Vampyre_Dark

  • Regular
  • ***
  • Posts: 255
  • Hello!
    • Somewhere Over The Rainbow...
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #16 on: October 20, 2007, 09:12:13 am »
I use VSExpress as the compiler, but I prefer Code::Blocks as the IDE. I just want something small I can type in, and hit a button to compiler + run, not some monstrosity that will bring even my new PC to it's knees.  :lol:
C::B Wishlist
~BOYCOTT THE EVIL YELLOW BOXES~

Offline stahta01

  • Lives here!
  • ****
  • Posts: 6613
    • My Best Post
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #17 on: October 20, 2007, 12:31:03 pm »
The lack of plugin support can cause problems.  Microsoft did explicitly to limit the usage of the express version, if they hadn't most likely the users would of created enough free plugins to make the express version so usable most people would not upgrade.

I don't use plugins with express, but they do work. MS was complaining that someone violated the license when they wrote a plugin for express. So, it is the lack of legal support, maybe.

Tim S
C Programmer working to learn more about C++ and Git.
On Windows 7 64 bit and Windows 10 32 bit.
On Debian Stretch, compiling CB Trunk against wxWidgets 3.0.
--
When in doubt, read the CB WiKi FAQ. http://wiki.codeblocks.org

Offline shajunxing

  • Multiple posting newcomer
  • *
  • Posts: 25
  • Sorry for my poor English ;)
Re: Why CB over V2005express, etc.
« Reply #18 on: October 31, 2007, 12:28:17 pm »
C::B is small, portable and free, so it can be easily packed and copied to my students. In addition, gcc is better than vc in some aspacts. For example: gcc uses msvcrt.dll while vc uses msvcr70.dll or msvcr71.dll. msvcrt.dll is included in all windows version and actually there is basically no differences between these dlls.