Author Topic: MSVS 2005 released...  (Read 17703 times)

Offline TDragon

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #15 on: December 13, 2005, 04:02:46 pm »
Thanks for the answers. Maybe Microsoft will release a 2005 toolkit.
I would suspect they wouldn't do that since they've provided VC2005 Express for free, which includes the whole optimizing compiler (minus the "Profile Guided Optimization" from the professional editions which is actually an add-on component).
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Offline 280Z28

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #16 on: December 13, 2005, 04:13:30 pm »
I have access to the mommajamma Visual Studio Team Server 2005 at work. I will be working on the Visual Studio related C::B features eventually. (importing, etc.)

It's a very powerful program, and having familiar options for VS users available will make C::B a VERY attractive option for people who use it at work and want a near-0 learning-curve option they can use at home for free.

Sam
« Last Edit: December 13, 2005, 04:15:57 pm by 280Z28 »
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Offline takeshi miya

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #17 on: December 13, 2005, 04:52:31 pm »
It would be interesting to know what kind of features a Visual Studio user is really missing now in C::B.

Offline Michael

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #18 on: December 13, 2005, 04:53:38 pm »
I would suspect they wouldn't do that since they've provided VC2005 Express for free, which includes the whole optimizing compiler (minus the "Profile Guided Optimization" from the professional editions which is actually an add-on component).

I think the same too. Visual Studio 2005 Express is free of charges for the first year and the price would be later quite low. But Express Edition lack of some interesting features. I suppose that M$ will with the Express Edition gives a taste of Visual Studio 2005 in the hope ( :roll:) that their users will switch to an improved, rich and expensive version.

Michael

Offline TDragon

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #19 on: December 13, 2005, 05:20:56 pm »
It would be interesting to know what kind of features a Visual Studio user is really missing now in C::B.
I'll chime in, but I may not be the most representative of Visual Studio users...
Anyway, the reason I downloaded and use (half of the time) VC2005 Express was for "consistency": consistently working code completion and debugging. Since C::B is a beta product, I'm sure these will improve over time (and I hope to help in their improvement). Everything else I use in VS works satisfactorily in C::B.
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Offline takeshi miya

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #20 on: December 13, 2005, 05:51:01 pm »
Somehow I've looked at the MSVC 2005 interface, and everything is made in .NET forms.
The interface looks ugly (the buttons are bigger than normal, lot's of refresh problems, and slower overall) so the GUI is not like using native widgets and looks ugly.
In fact, C::B using wxWidgets looks a lot more native (and better) than MSVC 2005 which is weird :lol:

I'm thinking M$ is doing that on purpose, so their .NET widgets looks ugly in WinXP but fine in Vista...

Offline 280Z28

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #21 on: December 13, 2005, 05:57:07 pm »
It would be interesting to know what kind of features a Visual Studio user is really missing now in C::B.

Attachable build property sheets

Virtual space option ;)

Code refactoring

.NET language support - autocompletion of the .NET Framework

Go to definition in addition to go to declaration for functions

Class diagrams

Monstrously powerful debugger - I haven't used the one in C::B to compare yet

Somehow I've looked at the MSVC 2005 interface, and everything is made in .NET forms.
The interface looks ugly (the buttons are bigger than normal, lot's of refresh problems, and slower overall) so the GUI is not like using native widgets and looks ugly.
In fact, C::B using wxWidgets looks a lot more native (and better) than MSVC 2005 which is weird :lol:

I'm thinking M$ is doing that on purpose, so their .NET widgets looks ugly in WinXP but fine in Vista...

I really like the look and feel of VS 2005. It's not sluggish on a fast computer.
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Offline takeshi miya

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #22 on: December 13, 2005, 06:57:49 pm »
Quote from: 280Z28
Attachable build property sheets
What is that?

Quote from: 280Z28
Virtual space option ;)
You're welcome to DIY :)

Quote from: 280Z28
Code refactoring
This feature would be easy to do once we have a good AST build from the code.
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1228838&group_id=126998&atid=707419
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1341566&group_id=126998&atid=707419


Quote from: 280Z28
.NET language support - autocompletion of the .NET Framework
I don't want to start flamewars so I'll pass on this. :P

Quote from: 280Z28
Go to definition in addition to go to declaration for functions
Yes, very needed feature, I've submited a FR:
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1362947&group_id=126998&atid=707419

Quote from: 280Z28
Class diagrams
Again, not difficult to do once we have an AST. But until that... very unlikely.
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1228844&group_id=126998&atid=707419
http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1228839&group_id=126998&atid=707419

Quote from: 280Z28
Monstrously powerful debugger - I haven't used the one in C::B to compare yet
When you've compared them let us know what you're really missing from it.

Quote from: 280Z28
I really like the look and feel of VS 2005. It's not sluggish on a fast computer.
I don't know if my Athlon 64 3000+ isn't fast, but VS 2005 have noticeable delay when doing anything.

Here are screenshoots of the Save As dialog:

MSVC 6: Uses MFC, looks native. Well drawn buttons and combobox.


MSVC 2005: Uses .NET, doesn't look native. Big buttons and combobox, everything ugly.


C::B: Uses wx, looks native, and haves more functionality than MSVC 6. Everything well drawn.


So far, that is an example. The MSVC 2005 configuration dialogs looks even more ugly...

Also note that the MSVC 6 & C::B dialogs are internationalized, whereas the MSVC 2005 is not.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2005, 07:01:51 pm by Takeshi Miya »

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #23 on: December 17, 2005, 10:05:29 pm »
Thats because you isnt using the "standard" windows decorations :)

with standard install of xp/vs2k5 its more like;


Anyway like CodeBlocks :)

Offline takeshi miya

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #24 on: December 18, 2005, 01:42:21 am »
Anyways, notice the buttons, the icons, the sidebar, the language (not translated).
They really know how to make non-native things for their own OS.

Offline Conan Kudo

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Re: MSVS 2005 released...
« Reply #25 on: February 26, 2006, 05:25:15 pm »
I believe the VC2005 express just wraps a improved VC2003 toolkit with the options changed... Everything else is the same compared to the toolkit, which is why some programs built with the express edition will break when trying to compile with the professional edition... I know this because I originally had the express edition, but when the higher-ups gave me professional edition, most of my programs broke because they were written in a form that works only with express edition... I had to change compiler setttings, modify projects, the whole works....
« Last Edit: February 26, 2006, 05:27:57 pm by Pharaoh Atem »